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debian-user-digest Digest V2007 #1844

From: <debian-user-digest-request(at)lists.debian.org>
Date: Mon Jun 25 2007 - 13:07:42 EDT


Content-Type: text/plain

debian-user-digest Digest Volume 2007 : Issue 1844

Today's Topics: 

  Re: shell : is syntax checking via o  [ Bruno Costacurta  ]
  Re: stability problem; Asus M2N-MX m  [ Andrew Sackville-West  ]
  Problem with argus-client on etch (8  [ Jon Ingason  ]
  Re: Using Debian Package Manager      [ Pol Hallen  ]
  [OT] package for talking to usb devi  [ Micha Feigin  ]
  OT: QEMU Package faster               [ Mike McCarty 

Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:19:29 +0200


From: Bruno Costacurta <pubmb01@skynet.be>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Re: shell : is syntax checking via option -n really working ?
Message-Id: <200706251719.29812.pubmb01@skynet.be>
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On Monday 25 June 2007 17:13:06 Mathias Brodala wrote:

> Hi Bruno.
>
> Bruno Costacurta, 25.06.2007 17:04:
> > Hello,
> > as I ckeck a script via 'sh -n <file>' I receive the syntax error
> >
> > listserver.tcl: 31: Syntax error: "else" unexpected (expecting "then")
> >
> > However syntax looks good and script execution is fine.
>
> But it=E2=80=99s an TCL script and not a shell script? How do you expect =

the normal

> shell to understand this script and its syntax?
>
>
> Regards, Mathias

Well...indeed...sorry for my confusion.=20


Do you need help?X

Bye,


Bruno



=2D-=20


PGP key ID: 0x2e604d51


Key server: hkp://subkeys.pgp.net


Key fingerprint =3D 713F 7956 9441 7DEF 58ED  1951 7E07 569B 2E60 4D51
=2D-



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Date:  Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:20:11 +0200


From: baldyeti <e_fax_t@hotmail.com>


To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject:  Re: how to install ntfs-3g from etch-backports

Message-ID: 
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> To install an new kernel you need package linux-image-2.6.21*. I cannot find
> this for Etch at backports.org or anywhere else. (You have probably seen
> linux-headers-2.6.21*).
Do you need more help?X

Backports has linux-image-2.6.21-1-k7, I just installed it without a hitch.


> You have to compile fuse too - see my previous post. I think that you will need
> to load it as a module in your new kernel.

Yes, ntfs-3g wants the upgraded fuse components (module, libs, toools)
before it even compiles. Mmh, I wanted this install to stay as "debian
stable" as possible (with the occasional backport).


> If you have spare HDD space you could install a second Debian Etch system. Then
> either build and experiment with your new kernel there or upgrade it to Sid
> (Unstable) where everything you want is available from Apt.

Yes, I've got sidux installed on another partition; that'll have to do.
I think reliable NTFS read/write is a major recent advance that matters
to many of us who dual-boot. Too bad it appeared just slightly too late
for debian stable...



--bald



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 08:42:47 -0700


From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Re: stability problem; Asus M2N-MX mobo AMD 64; etch; is it hardware or software?
Message-ID: <20070625154247.GL12527@localhost.localdomain>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1;

Can we help you?X

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On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 11:09:33AM +0000, Prismatic Plasma wrote:

> On Monday 25 June 2007 05:31, Andrew Sackville-West wrote:
> > On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 03:19:22AM +0000, Prismatic Plasma wrote:
> > > I've had this problem for a while, and I can't seem to solve or even
> > > fully diagnose what's wrong. The 2 most common symptoms are:
> > > 1) random segmentation faults during compiling.=20

=2E..


> > memory.
> >
> > > 2) occasionally the system goes wild and thrashing,=20

=2E..


> > maybe memory.
> >
>=20
> Do you mean bad ram? Or is it a timing issue from bios that need twiddlin=

g?=20

> The machine's been flakey like this since I got it.
>=20

either one. They just sound like memory problems to me. I see you've
already messed with the voltage. maybe the timings are the issue. If
you have spare ram sticks around, start playing around with them in
different positions/combinations (make notes -- I have to or I get
confused) and see if you can figure out if one is bad. If you don't
have spares, but have more than one instaleld and can live with less
than your present ram, you can pull one and then other too.=20


Can't find what you're looking for?X

A



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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:35:27 +0300


From: David Baron <d_baron@012.net.il>


To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Re: RTF - proprietary or open?

Message-id: <200706251835.27913.d_baron@012.net.il>
Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15
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> I'm using Abiword, which recommends using RTF for document exchange
> with non-Abi users. =A0I'm trying to understand whether RTF is an open
> standard. =A0Wikipedia [0] claims that it's proprietary. =A0This article
> [1] points out that it has the same status as PDF. =A0I can't imagine
> that Abi would recommend a non-open standard, and even prefer it to ODF
> (OASIS / XML) [2]. =A0What does it even mean for a file format to be
> open? That the creator can't restrict its use? That the spec has been
> published?
>
> [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format
> [1] http://www.tkachenko.com/blog/archives/000657.html
> [2] http://www.abisource.com/mailinglists/abiword-dev/2003/Apr/0167.html

As I have said, RTF is Microsoft's language and maintaining RTF readers is=
=20


chasing a moving target. However, there is a document published specifying=
=20


the language and sticking to that should work. Problem is all the proprieta=
ry=20


stuff that gets added in my Microsoft (and others).


Confused? Frustrated?X

RTF can go in and out of Word, Abiword, Kword, Openoffice. Each has its=20
problems but it can be done. RTF was the intermediary for most all of the=20
Dagesh/Accent filters as well.



Microsoft does not restrict its use to my knowledge.



Note: SQL is also theirs so their initiating a standard (even if they fudge=
 it=20


all the time) does not make it unacceptable!



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:49:06 +0200


From: Jon Ingason <jon.ingason@sentor.se>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Problem with argus-client on etch (86_64)

Message-ID: <467FE3F2.40907@sentor.se>
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I have problem reading argus files made on sarge (i686) with
argus-client on etch (86_64). The version of argus-client is
2.0.6.fixes.1-2 on sarge, while etch has version 2.0.6.fixes.1-3.
The result on etch is that when runing ra it directly one line with
nonsense data though the format is right.



What is the problem?


- --


Regards


Call Pantek today for Open Source Technical Support at 1-877-546-8934 - 24/7/365X

Jon Ingason

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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:02:04 +0200


From: Pol Hallen <debianen@fuckaround.org>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Cc: russ421@aol.com


Subject: Re: Using Debian Package Manager
Message-Id: <200706251802.04432.debianen@fuckaround.org>
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> I wanted to install a motherboard monitor.? I found one in the list,
> xmbmon, and chose to install it.? It said installation complete.? However,
> I have no idea how to find it and run it.? It's not showing up in the
> applications list anywhere.


Sorry, but i never used xmbmon :-(



u could do: apt-get install xmbmon


and dpkg -L xmbmon


to see where are the package of files are installed in your os.
ok, normally every /bin/files are executable files that u can run



example: /bin/./df


> So basically I'm curious about that package manager.? Once installed, are
> icons created anywhere to run them easily?

yes :-) normally yes 



Pol


Do you need help?X

Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:00:31 -0600


From: Keith Christian <keithchristian@yahoo.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Re: Using Debian Package Manager

Message-ID: <467FE69F.4020704@yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
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russ421@aol.com wrote:


 > I just installed Debian.  I'm wondering about the Synaptic Package Manager.  As I've never 
used a GUI for Linux before, I will need to get used to how things work.



[stuff deleted]



 > So basically I'm curious about that package manager.  Once installed, are icons created 
anywhere to run them easily?



Someone else can chime in with how to find the xmbmon app in the menu structure.



Here are a couple of ways to get an overview of what a package installed.



  1.   Open a command window ( From the Gnome menu bar, click Applications / Accessories / Terminal)

  
  2.   At the terminal prompt, type




     dpkg -L xmbmon


Do you need more help?X

3. In the output list, you'll see /usr/bin/xmbmon, so that's where the program itself is. You'll 
see other references to "/usr/share/doc/xmbmon" and "/usr/share/man/man1" which mean there is 
documentation in those two directories.



4. To see the documentation, type "zless /usr/share/doc/xmbmon/ReadMe.gz" or, type "man xmbmon" 
to see the man page.



5. "dpkg" above is the debian package manager, a command line utility.  Here is a page showing 
how to find out about Debian packages, worth the read:



     http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/quick-reference/ch-package.en.html

Hope this helps.



========Keith


        



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:25:27 -0400


From: Matthew K Poer <matthewpoer@gmail.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org


Subject: Re: OT: QEMU Package faster


Message-Id: <200706251225.31661.matthewpoer@gmail.com>
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Perhaps, if you enabled non-free software on her computer, kqemu is install=
ed?=20


it is a processor accelerator for qemu, but it is not DFSG-compliant, so it=
=20


is in the non-free repo.



On Monday 25 June 2007 12:17 pm, Mike McCarty wrote:

> This question is really Really REALLY off topic!
>
> I administer my girl friend's Debian machine for her, but do
> not run Debian myself. I installed QEMU on my machine (Fedora
> Core) from source, and installed the Debian release on hers.
> She's pretty happy now running some stuff. But I noticed that
> on her machine, QEMU does not eat lots of CPU, while on my
> machine, it eats the machine. I've copied the exact raw image
> disc from her machine to mine, but QEMU eats my CPU.
>
> I wonder what changes the Debian release team made to QEMU
> to make it run nicer. Does anyone know?
>
> Mike
> --
> p=3D"p=3D%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
> Oppose globalization and One World Governments like the UN.
> This message made from 100% recycled bits.
> You have found the bank of Larn.
> I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
> I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!

=2D-=20


Matthew K Poer <matthewpoer@gmail.com>

Location: GA, USA              Web: 
http://matthewpoer.freehostia.com
GnuPG Public Key: 4DD0A9A6     Keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net


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Can't find what you're looking for?X

Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 11:01:30 -0500


From: Mike McCarty <Mike.McCarty@sbcglobal.net>
To: Debian user list <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Subject: Re: Sound card not working

Message-ID: <467FE6DA.4000102@sbcglobal.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
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Mike McCarty wrote:



[that the sound card isn't working]



Ok, after much fooling around, I find that ESD is running, and
has the DSP open. So, I killed it, and things got farther. But,
still weren't working. Looking around some more got to the
point where something complained that ALSA wasn't there. I
installed ALSA, and now the sound works for sound apps. It
still doesn't work for the "system sounds", the ones for
"you have mail", "game won" etc.



I have written a little script which displays the process
id of ESD, which allows one to kill it by hand. If I knew
more script programming, I could probably verify it and
kill it from the script.



This is a work-around, not a fix, IMO. What is ESD, and
why does it interfere? It appears to be a sound server.
So, if that's the way things are supposed to work, then
why don't the apps use the server socket? If it isn't
the way things are supposed to work, then why is it running?
Or, if that's the way some things work, but not others
(like GNOME likes ESD, but other apps don't) then is there
some way to get them to coexist? I see that ESD is set
to release the DSP after 5 secs. Yet, it seems that it
doesn't.



Anyway, sound now sorta works.



Thanks for your time.


Don't know where to look next?X

Mike

-- 
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
Oppose globalization and One World Governments like the UN.
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!


Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:32:43 +0200
From: Mathias Brodala <info@noctus.net>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: OT: QEMU Package faster
Message-ID: <467FEE2B.2060005@noctus.net>
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Hi Matthew.

Matthew K Poer, 25.06.2007 18:25:

> Perhaps, if you enabled non-free software on her computer, kqemu is ins=

talled?=20

> it is a processor accelerator for qemu, but it is not DFSG-compliant, s=

o it=20

> is in the non-free repo.


Not anymore. It=E2=80=99s licensed unter GPL since February.


Regards, Mathias

--=20
debian/rules


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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 19:18:08 +0300 (IDT)
From: Micha Feigin <michf@post.tau.ac.il>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: [OT] package for talking to usb device using visa protocol
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.61.0706251915530.2208@nova.cs.tau.ac.il>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed

Hopping that I didn't miss spell this, I am looking for a reference or 
preferably a library that would enable me to talk to a usb device that 
uses the vesa protocol. I found some info from national instruments that 
the device should be available under /dev but no code
Will be grateful for any pointers
thanks



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 11:17:32 -0500
From: Mike McCarty <Mike.McCarty@sbcglobal.net>
To: Debian user list <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Subject: OT: QEMU Package faster
Message-ID: <467FEA9C.2050703@sbcglobal.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This question is really Really REALLY off topic!

I administer my girl friend's Debian machine for her, but do
not run Debian myself. I installed QEMU on my machine (Fedora
Core) from source, and installed the Debian release on hers.
She's pretty happy now running some stuff. But I noticed that
on her machine, QEMU does not eat lots of CPU, while on my
machine, it eats the machine. I've copied the exact raw image
disc from her machine to mine, but QEMU eats my CPU.

I wonder what changes the Debian release team made to QEMU
to make it run nicer. Does anyone know?

Mike
-- 
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
Oppose globalization and One World Governments like the UN.
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:23:09 +0000
From: Prismatic Plasma <meltedrainbow@adelphia.net>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: stability problem; Asus M2N-MX mobo AMD 64; etch; is it hardware or software?
Message-Id: <200706251723.09513.meltedrainbow@adelphia.net>
Content-Type: text/plain;
  charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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On Monday 25 June 2007 15:42, Andrew Sackville-West wrote:

> > Do you mean bad ram? Or is it a timing issue from bios that need
> > twiddling? The machine's been flakey like this since I got it.
>
> either one. They just sound like memory problems to me. I see you've
> already messed with the voltage. maybe the timings are the issue. If
> you have spare ram sticks around, start playing around with them in
> different positions/combinations (make notes -- I have to or I get
> confused) and see if you can figure out if one is bad. If you don't
> have spares, but have more than one instaleld and can live with less
> than your present ram, you can pull one and then other too.
>
> A


Unfortunately, I have only 1 compatible with this machine.  [sidebar: kicking 
self in head while shouting, "Always buy 2 sticks so you can do tests like 
this. Always buy 2 sticks so you can do tests like this...]

What's reasonably safe and worthwhile to play with in the timings? Default 
bios gives me 400 MHz, CL5-5-5-12 (I think there's three 5's.). But stick 
says PC2 6400 (800 MHz I presume), CL4-4-4-12. When I try these values, 
there's no change in stability. Is there some other combination that might 
work? There's a large amount of possible combinations.



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 19:27:33 +0300
From: ndemou@gmail.com
To: "David Baron" <d_baron@012.net.il>
Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: RTF - proprietary or open?
Message-ID: <cc703c350706250927q5f573087k5e3094f82f04caad@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
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On 6/25/07, David Baron <d_baron@012.net.il> wrote:

> > I'm using Abiword, which recommends using RTF for document exchange
> > with non-Abi users.  I'm trying to understand whether RTF is an open
> > standard.  Wikipedia [0] claims that it's proprietary.  This article
> > [1] points out that it has the same status as PDF.  I can't imagine
> > that Abi would recommend a non-open standard, and even prefer it to ODF
> > (OASIS / XML) [2].  What does it even mean for a file format to be
> > open? That the creator can't restrict its use? That the spec has been
> > published?
> >
> > [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rich_Text_Format
> > [1] http://www.tkachenko.com/blog/archives/000657.html
> > [2] http://www.abisource.com/mailinglists/abiword-dev/2003/Apr/0167.html
>


you can check these
http://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&sid=20061204130954610&amp;title=RTF+specification+timeline&type=article&order=&hideanonymous=0&pid=512993#c513503
http://blogs.msdn.com/brian_jones/archive/2005/10/01/476067.aspx#476910

Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 09:49:19 -0700
From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: OT: QEMU Package faster
Message-ID: <20070625164919.GM12527@localhost.localdomain>
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On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 12:25:27PM -0400, Matthew K Poer wrote:

> Perhaps, if you enabled non-free software on her computer, kqemu is insta=

lled?=20

> it is a processor accelerator for qemu, but it is not DFSG-compliant, so =

it=20

> is in the non-free repo.
>=20


I agree this is probably it. kqemu makes a *HUGE* difference in
performance. On my k7 machine it must quadruple performance (I've not
measured it, but if feels like it).=20

However, that said, if I watch my cpu meter, qemu, even under kqemu,
definitely eats some cpu (running win xp in the vm). But it seems to
play pretty nicely with others. So, is it eating all the cpu and
dragging everything else down with it? or is it just using lots of cpu
when it can?

A



> On Monday 25 June 2007 12:17 pm, Mike McCarty wrote:
> > This question is really Really REALLY off topic!
> >
> > I administer my girl friend's Debian machine for her, but do
> > not run Debian myself. I installed QEMU on my machine (Fedora
> > Core) from source, and installed the Debian release on hers.
> > She's pretty happy now running some stuff. But I noticed that
> > on her machine, QEMU does not eat lots of CPU, while on my
> > machine, it eats the machine. I've copied the exact raw image
> > disc from her machine to mine, but QEMU eats my CPU.
> >
> > I wonder what changes the Debian release team made to QEMU
> > to make it run nicer. Does anyone know?
> >
> > Mike
> > --
> > p=3D"p=3D%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
> > Oppose globalization and One World Governments like the UN.
> > This message made from 100% recycled bits.
> > You have found the bank of Larn.
> > I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
> > I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
>=20
> --=20
> Matthew K Poer <matthewpoer@gmail.com>
> Location: GA, USA              Web: http://matthewpoer.freehostia.com
> GnuPG Public Key: 4DD0A9A6     Keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net




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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 22:26:19 +0530
From: "Masatran, R. Deepak" <masatran@research.iiit.ac.in>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Fonts are small, in second X11 log-in
Message-ID: <20070625165619.GA1497@research.iiit.ac.in>
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I am using up-to-date Debian Testing on my laptop, mainly with XFCE and
Sawfish. All logging-in is from GDM. When I log-in as the first user, I get
the normal-sized fonts.

But when I log-in using "New login" in X-screen-saver, after someone else
has locked the screen, all the fonts are smaller than normal. How can I
solve this?

--=20
Masatran, R. Deepak <http://research.iiit.ac.in/~masatran/>

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Confused? Frustrated?X

Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 12:41:22 -0400
From: "Andrew J. Barr" <andrew.james.barr@gmail.com>
To: Matthew K Poer <matthewpoer@gmail.com>
Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: OT: QEMU Package faster
Message-ID: <20070625124122.51decf12@conroe.oakcourt.dyndns.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Matthew K Poer <matthewpoer@gmail.com> wrote:


> Perhaps, if you enabled non-free software on her computer, kqemu is
> installed? it is a processor accelerator for qemu, but it is not
> DFSG-compliant, so it is in the non-free repo.


kqemu is free software as of a few months ago.

-- 
Andrew J. Barr

Woke up in my clothes again this morning,
don't know exactly where I am...



Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 10:04:05 -0700
From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Sound card not working
Message-ID: <20070625170405.GN12527@localhost.localdomain>
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On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 11:01:30AM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote:

> Mike McCarty wrote:
>=20
> [that the sound card isn't working]
>=20
> Ok, after much fooling around, I find that ESD is running, and
> has the DSP open. So, I killed it,=20


it should be taken out and shot, IMHO.

we see so many problems related to esd not playing nicely with others.


> This is a work-around, not a fix, IMO. What is ESD, and
> why does it interfere? It appears to be a sound server.


yup. its the Enlightened Sound Daemon. It comes in with gnome, like a
little parasite, and messes it all up. I don't know why gnome doesn't
just use alsa and be done with it. I'm sure there must be some
compelling reason, but I can't see it. Particularly frustrating (for
me) is that if you like system sounds (which I do, for some stupid
reason) you can't get them in gnome without esd running. If you set it
to use alsasink (in gconf) it seems to be better as alsa allows
mixing. But if you switch do a different user without logging out (my
kids do this) then the second login doesn't get to use esd and thus
gets no system sounds. ugh.



> So, if that's the way things are supposed to work, then
> why don't the apps use the server socket?=20


because they have to be written to use it. Many of the sound apps
actually have an esd plugin or some other method to get to esd,
butyou're better off using alsa.

If it isn't

> the way things are supposed to work, then why is it running?


to make you crazy? ;)


> Or, if that's the way some things work, but not others
> (like GNOME likes ESD, but other apps don't) then is there
> some way to get them to coexist? I see that ESD is set
> to release the DSP after 5 secs. Yet, it seems that it
> doesn't.


yeah, I've noticed that too.

I have to say that since alsa started shipping with dmix by default,
it all works *much* better. But its still confusing and is (to my mind
at least) sucn an esoteric subject that its kind of all like
blackmagic to make it work properly.

A

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End of debian-user-digest Digest V2007 Issue #1844
**************************************************

Received on Mon Jun 25 13:08:03 2007

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