debian-user-digest Digest V2007 #3005

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debian-user-digest Digest Volume 2007 : Issue 3005

Today's Topics:

  xfce4-battery-plugin and kernel 2.6.  [ Celejar  ]
  Re: OT: clicky keyboards              [ Andrew Sackville-West  ]
  Re: Resolving apt-get unmet dependen  [ Ron Johnson  ]
  Re: OT: clicky keyboards              [ "Douglas A. Tutty"  ]
  Re: Network is unreachable email err  [ Andrei Popescu 

Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 10:43:42 -0500


From: Celejar <celejar@gmail.com>


To: debian-user <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Subject: xfce4-battery-plugin and kernel 2.6.24-rc4
Message-Id: <20071214104342.af972703.celejar@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,


I'm using the plugin mentioned in the subject.  It works correctly with
all Debian packaged kernels that I've tried, but when I use
2.6.24-rc4 (vanilla from kernel.org), it erroneously reports "AC
off-line" and "28%" (always!), even though the adapter is plugged in
and the battery is fully charged.  'acpi -t' gives the correct state,
and the values in '/proc/acpi/battery' and 'ac_adapter' seem correct.
Do I file a bug somewhere?


Celejar
--
mailmin.sourceforge.net - remote access via secure (OpenPGP) email
ssuds.sourceforge.net - A Simple Sudoku Solver and Generator

Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:05:48 -0800
From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: OT: clicky keyboards
Message-ID: <20071214160548.GA3266@localhost.localdomain>
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On Fri, Dec 14, 2007 at 08:37:42AM +0000, Brad Rogers wrote:

> On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 20:57:15 -0500
> "Douglas A. Tutty" <dtutty@porchlight.ca> wrote:
>=20
> Hello Douglas,
>=20
> > Anybody remember the Timex/Sinclair 1000?  It has a pure membrane
>=20
> AKA the Sinclair ZX-81, in the UK.  First computer I owned.


I remember those (US). THere was a lot of competition between all of
us (this was 8th - 11th grade for me) with those kids who had the
Atari based rigs being all uppity about their games or something, and
us C-64 kids being all uppity about the fact that we could swap the
whole OS into ram and start rewriting the BASIC interpreter. 6502/6510
assembler was pretty straightforward as well and a lot of us started
really playing around with that. As I recall, I typed in an assembler
written in BASIC to build my first assembler program. And then the
sprites -- that was a lot of fun too. YOu could map the sprite
anywhere in memory you wanted and just change the pointer -- simple
effective animation by just updating that pointer every few ticks.=20

Sorry, I got off track there. The Timex... hmmm... some kid had one
but I don't think anyone ever got it to do anything interesting. I
remember that the keyboard was hideous though.=20

A

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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:10:23 -0800
From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Latest kernel security update wont boot resolved
Message-ID: <20071214161023.GB3266@localhost.localdomain>
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On Thu, Dec 13, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0500, Marc Auslander wrote:

> The problem is operator (that's me) stupidity.
>
> I have an overloaded find so I can say find foo and have it mean
> find . -name foo -print
>
> mkinitramfs uses find . | cpio to build the initrd.img
>


ooh, interesting. I wouldn't have seen that coming from a mile
away. HOw do you have that overloading set up? and how does
mkinitramfs use find. If it uses the full path, then you could alias
find to a "my_find_script.sh" and still get your desired performance
without interfering with well written utils that use find.


>
> I've wasted my time - i deserve it - and your time - you don't.
>
> Sorry.
>


not at all... this is how we learn. Now we, and everyone reading this
thread, know that this can happen.... IT's another symptom to be aware
of. An initrd that comes out too small might be because it just
doesn't find the modules properly.=20

A

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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 11:10:40 -0500
From: "Douglas A. Tutty" <dtutty@porchlight.ca>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Preferred Backup Method?
Message-ID: <20071214161040.GA6669@titan.hooton>
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On Fri, Dec 07, 2007 at 09:21:30AM -0600, Ron Johnson wrote:

> On 12/07/07 07:45, Douglas A. Tutty wrote:
> > On Fri, Dec 07, 2007 at 07:55:55AM -0500, Paul Cartwright wrote:
> >> On Thu December 6 2007, Bill Smith wrote:
> >>> I am pleased to announce LiveCD/LiveDVD image updates: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
> >>> ? ? ?  4.2-release for i386 is now available. ?There is a bug with the XFCE
> >>> image, so that is still 4.1.  amd64 architecture will follow within the
> >>> next few weeks.  www.jggimi.homeip.net
> >> wow, amazing how much larger the KDE implementation is than all the others.. 
> >> almost 50% larger than gnome, and more than twice the size of XFCE..
> > 
> > They'll all be larger than a non-GUI OpenBSD since regular OBSD doesn't
> > have all the cruft (compiled against extra libs) that a linux system
> > does.  Any GUI then brings in far more libs than on linux.
> 
> Can you explain that a bit?


I don't have hard data.  However, a while ago (couple of months?) there
was a discussion on running on a small hard drive and one of the DDs
mentioned that Debian did tend to link against more libs than other
distros.  I don't know which or why.  So, if a typical Debian
system, before installation of a GUI, already has libs installed as
dependancies of base or other packages, then installing the GUI will not
require a re-download or re-install of those already-installed libs.  A
typical OpenBSD install probably won't have those libs installed as part
of base and so will have to install them with the GUI.  This is one
reason why a GUI install on Debian may take less addition room than on
OpenBSD.

The other reason is that Debian gives you more granularity.  For
example, on OpenBSD there are two versions of Konqueror: one which is
for stand-alone use (doesn't depend on other KDE components) and a full
version which depends on lots of KDE stuff to give you all the possible
features of Konqueror.  Compare this with all the packages on Debian
that relate to adding features to Konq.

If you look at the list of packages for OpenBSD (see the web site; I
don't have the URL handy), you'll see similar choices for several
packages.  In fact, OpenBSD's pkg_add has the -i interactive option
whereby if you don't specify the version to install, it will prompt you.
You still have to refer to the package descriptions to get the details.  

I hope its clear from this that I'm not complaining about anything, I'm
just observing the difference between the packaging philosophies.

Doug.


Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 11:16:58 -0500
From: "Douglas A. Tutty" <dtutty@porchlight.ca>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Preferred Backup Method?
Message-ID: <20071214161658.GB6669@titan.hooton>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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On Fri, Dec 07, 2007 at 10:53:05AM -0800, David Brodbeck wrote:

> 
> On Dec 6, 2007, at 6:40 PM, Douglas A. Tutty wrote:
> >	It is BSD not Linux.  Linux is a bit of SysV and a bit of BSD.
> >	Permission of files inherit a bit of the directory they're in (I
> >	forget the details).  Initscrips are rc NOT SysV.  If you add a
> >	package you have to write the initscript snippet.
> 
> Although FreeBSD has started to include a sort of "mini-SysV" setup,  
> in /usr/local/etc/rc.d.  You can put a script in there and it will be  
> run with "start" as the argument when the system boots, and "stop"  
> with the argument when it shuts down.  This is a little bit nicer  
> than /etc/rc.local for stuff you need to shut down gracefully.
> 
> I don't know if this has made it into OpenBSD or not.
> 


No.  There's a fundamental difference between FreeBSD and OpenBSD.
FreeBSD seems to have an attitude to Linux as Linux has to Windows.  Try
to be like them and convert users by making configs easy.  OpenBSD does
nothing to convert users; it doesn't care about users.  Its by
developers for developers.  Developers can write their own rc.local
snippet.  There's also an aversion to adding layers which add complexity
to something.  Adding daemons to an OpenBSD box happens rarely, why
compicate every boot process?

NetBSD has the rcorder script where the order of initscripts is
calculated at each boot based on hints in each file.  It may have been
from FreeBSD or not; I don't know.

Doug.


Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:17:12 -0800
From: Andrew Sackville-West <andrew@farwestbilliards.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: FreeAgent USB HDD (update)
Message-ID: <20071214161712.GC3266@localhost.localdomain>
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On Thu, Dec 13, 2007 at 11:01:54PM +0100, Wim De Smet wrote:

> On Nov 29, 2007 9:18 PM, andy <geek_show@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> > I rebooted and then once I went into the filesystem I saw that the
> > system recognised it, but did not automount it. This is something that I
> > have noticed in the last while - USB data sticks are not being
> > automounted the way they used to be (although, I cannot determine a
> > turning point in this). They used to trigger an icon to be placed on my
> > Gnome desktop once I inserted the stick but now I have to manually open
> > the filesystem and click on the USB drive to mount it. I have double
> > checked my prefs under Gnome for storage devices, and the option to
> > automount and auto-browse are selected, so I don't know what is going on
> > with that.
> >
> > Anyway, crisis with the FreeAgent drive is over. Now I only have this
> > mild curiosity re: the automount/auto-browse issue. Anyone have some
> > light to shine on this?
>=20
> This could be for a number of reasons. Most likely first choice would
> be the gnome settings about removable devices. If somehow they got set
> to not mount the device automatically that would be a problem. Your
> user needs to be in the plugdev group (check with groups <username>),
> hald and udev need to be properly installed and running. hald needs
> certain libraries which may or may not be bugged, upgrade everything
> involved to the latest version you can and try again.


I've lost the beginnings of this thread, but there was a recent story
about Seagate FreeAgent drives being (intentionally?) designed to
*not* work with Linux.=20

http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=3D07/12/09/0651200

I actually emailed SeaGate as I've been using their drives very
happily for a couple of years (can't beat 5yr warranty for the price)
and was really disappointed by this development. I told them I
wouldn't be buying/recommending seagate in the future. They actually
bothered to respond! Something like: we're sorry, but we do offer a
number of other drives that are fully compatible. basically
sidestepping my questions and writing me off as a customer. oh well.

A

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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 08:25:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Robert Key <robertgordonkey@yahoo.com>
To: debian user <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Subject: custom kernel boot problem: can't access tty
Message-ID: <86909.10126.qm@web45604.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1137896405-1197649514=:10126"

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Hi,
 I compiled a debian custom kernel 2.6.18 to boot a USB flash drive. The stock kernels  work perfectly, but my custom kernel mounts the root fs and then gives the error message:

/bin/sh Can't access tty; Job control stopped

The booting process stops. The console , tty devices are all there, stock kernel works perfectly what is wrong?
Thanks
 
Rob Key




      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Looking for last minute shopping deals?  
Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.  http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
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<html><head><style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></head><body><div style="font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt">Hi,<br>&nbsp;I compiled a debian custom kernel 2.6.18 to boot a USB flash drive. The stock kernels&nbsp; work perfectly, but my custom kernel mounts the root fs and then gives the error message:<br><br>/bin/sh Can't access tty; Job control stopped<br><br>The booting process stops. The console , tty devices are all there, stock kernel works perfectly what is wrong?<br>Thanks<br><div>&nbsp;</div>Rob Key<div><br></div></div><br>



      <hr size=1>Never miss a thing.  <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51438/*http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs"> Make Yahoo your homepage.</a>

</body></html>
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Date:  Sat, 15 Dec 2007 00:35:50 +0800
From:  Uwe Dippel <udippel@uniten.edu.my>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject:  Re: Network (LAN) 'lost'
Message-ID:  <pan.2007.12.14.16.35.49.349822@uniten.edu.my>
Content-Type:  text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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On Tue, 11 Dec 2007 16:11:57 +0100, Benjamin Schmidt wrote:


> The configuration file you need, is:
> /etc/udev/rules.d/z25_persistent-net.rules
>=20
> delete the entry with "eth0" and rename the other entry from eth2 to
> eth0. Ok, now reboot (or only restart udev, don't know) and you will
> have eth0 again.


True enough. Tried it, and spot on! /etc/init.d/udev stop / start will
bring it back.

Filed a bug report (456197), but was shot down:
"Sorry. So far people who know about udev and the kernel much more than
you have not found better solutions" and 'closed'.

"Intelligence remains constant, but the number of people increases"

Thanks again, Benjamin !

Uwe


Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 11:48:32 -0600
From: Ron Johnson <ron.l.johnson@cox.net>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Resolving apt-get unmet dependencies
Message-Id: <200712141148.40633.ron.l.johnson@cox.net>
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On Friday 14 December 2007 08:26:04 am axelle_apvrille@yahoo.fr=20
wrote:

> Hi,
> I'm sure this is pretty simple, but I can't get it to work...
>
> Can somebody explain how I can install libc6-dev ?
> I keep getting an error message from apt-get, which I do not
> know how to solve:
> #apt-get install libc6-dev
> ...
> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
>   libc6-dev: Depends: libc6 (=3D 2.3.6.ds1-13etch2) but 2.6.1-3
> is to be installed
> E: Broken packages
>
> My sources.list is:
>
> deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 r1 _Etch_ - Official amd64
> NETINST Binary-1 20070820-20:16]/
> etch contrib main
>
> deb http://ftp.fr.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib non-free
> deb-src http://ftp.fr.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib
> non-free
>
> deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main contrib
> deb-src http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main contrib


This should point you in the right direction:

# apt-cache policy libc6-dev libc6

=2D-=20
=2D----------------------------------------------------------------
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson, LA  USA

"You're a good example of why some animals eat their young."
Jim Samuels

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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 12:49:13 -0500
From: "Douglas A. Tutty" <dtutty@porchlight.ca>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: OT: clicky keyboards
Message-ID: <20071214174913.GA7049@titan.hooton>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline

On Fri, Dec 14, 2007 at 08:05:48AM -0800, Andrew Sackville-West wrote:
 Sorry, I got off track there. The Timex... hmmm... some kid had one

> but I don't think anyone ever got it to do anything interesting. I
> remember that the keyboard was hideous though. 


I had a model submarine.  I didn't want to do a direct connect from it
to the Z80 bus for controll.  I couldn't afforad to build an
opto-isolator for it.  So I used the TV screen.  I covered the top half
with photo-sensors.  Had my program put black blobs on the appropriate
spot on the screen and that did whatever to the submarine.  Looked wierd
but at least a power short on the sub couldn't fry the computer.

Doug.


Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 18:38:31 +0000
From: andy <geek_show@dsl.pipex.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: FreeAgent USB HDD (update)
Message-ID: <4762CDA7.6000701@dsl.pipex.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Wim De Smet wrote:

> On Nov 29, 2007 9:18 PM, andy <geek_show@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>   
>> I rebooted and then once I went into the filesystem I saw that the
>> system recognised it, but did not automount it. This is something that I
>> have noticed in the last while - USB data sticks are not being
>> automounted the way they used to be (although, I cannot determine a
>> turning point in this). They used to trigger an icon to be placed on my
>> Gnome desktop once I inserted the stick but now I have to manually open
>> the filesystem and click on the USB drive to mount it. I have double
>> checked my prefs under Gnome for storage devices, and the option to
>> automount and auto-browse are selected, so I don't know what is going on
>> with that.
>>
>> Anyway, crisis with the FreeAgent drive is over. Now I only have this
>> mild curiosity re: the automount/auto-browse issue. Anyone have some
>> light to shine on this?
>>     
>
> This could be for a number of reasons. Most likely first choice would
> be the gnome settings about removable devices. If somehow they got set
> to not mount the device automatically that would be a problem. Your
> user needs to be in the plugdev group (check with groups <username>),
> hald and udev need to be properly installed and running. hald needs
> certain libraries which may or may not be bugged, upgrade everything
> involved to the latest version you can and try again.
>
> That's just of the top of my head. Let us know if you make any progress. :-)
>
> greets,
> Wim
>
>
>   

Hi Wim

I am a member of the plugdev group, hald and udev are all upgraded to 
the latest in Lenny and while the device does auto-mount, my query was 
more around why I no longer get an icon telling me that the device has 
auto-mounted on the Gnome desktop as I used to. I've checked the admin 
and preferences for Gnome and all seems to be fine. It isn't a biggie 
'cos I can easily get around it, just more of a curiosity.

Andrew - earlier on in this thread I cited a web page that had some very 
helpful steps to making the FreeAgent drive work which seems to operate 
by periodically cycling it around to keep it "live". As for the driver, 
I was able to download the relevant driver for it from the Lenny/Testing 
repository so didn't need to use their proprietary driver anyway. It is 
surprising that, in this day and age, that a company like Seagate would 
deliberately decide to deprecate support for the evidently growing army 
of GNU/Linux users. Doesn't seem like a wise business choice really. Do 
you know if that covers all of Seagate's products or just the FreeAgent 
drive?

Cheers

Andy

-- 

"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about the answers." - Thomas Pynchon, "Gravity's Rainbow"


Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 20:51:49 +0200
From: Andrei Popescu <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: Network is unreachable email error
Message-ID: <20071214185149.GA4941@think.homenet>
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On Fri, Dec 14, 2007 at 09:54:17PM +1100, hce wrote:
=20

> Could it be the problem of ssl-cert-snakeoil.pem and
> ssl-cert-snakeoil.key? Should I manually to create them by openssl
> (and how?)?
>=20
> smtpd_tls_cert_file=3D/etc/ssl/certs/ssl-cert-snakeoil.pem
> smtpd_tls_key_file=3D/etc/ssl/private/ssl-cert-snakeoil.key

-----^^^

You're the client here not the server. For gmail as relayhost I have=20
this setup:

---[ /etc/postfix/main.cf ]---

smtp_tls_policy_maps =3D hash:/etc/postfix/tls_policy
smtp_sasl_auth_enable =3D yes
smtp_sasl_password_maps =3D hash:/etc/postfix/sasl_passwd
smtp_sasl_type =3D cyrus
smtp_sasl_security_options =3D=20

------------------------------

---[ /etc/postfix/tls_policy ]---

[smtp.gmail.com]:587	encrypt

---------------------------------

---[ /etc/postfix/sasl_passwd ]---

[smtp.gmail.com]:587    my_email@gmail.com:my_password

----------------------------------

HTH,
Andrei
--=20
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.
(Albert Einstein)

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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 21:32:55 +0200
From: Andrei Popescu <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: How to start KDE from a console prompt?
Message-ID: <20071214193255.GB4941@think.homenet>
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On Tue, Dec 11, 2007 at 06:36:19PM -0800, Andrew Sackville-West wrote:
=20

> startx uses ~/.xinitrc to start up the X session. In case it doesn't
> exist, then debian has some default stuff that starts whatever the
> default window manager is. Look at `update-alternatives --config
> x-window-manager` to set a different window manager as the default.=20


On my box I have:

---[ begin console paste ]---

think:~# update-alternatives --config x-window-manager

There are 7 alternatives which provide `x-window-manager'.

  Selection    Alternative
-----------------------------------------------
          1    /usr/bin/icewm
          2    /usr/bin/icewm-experimental
          3    /usr/bin/xfwm4
*+        4    /usr/bin/openbox
          5    /usr/bin/openbox-session
          6    /usr/bin/kwin
          7    /usr/bin/startfluxbox

Press enter to keep the default[*], or type selection number:
think:~# update-alternatives --config x-session-manager

There are 3 alternatives which provide `x-session-manager'.

  Selection    Alternative
-----------------------------------------------
          1    /usr/bin/icewm-session
          2    /usr/bin/icewm-session-experimental
*+        3    /usr/bin/xfce4-session

Press enter to keep the default[*], or type selection number:
think:~#

---[ end console paste ]----

On 'startx' xfce4 is started so it seems the 'x-session-manager' takes=20
precedence over the 'x-window-manager'. This is on a sid box (and has=20
been like this for a while).

Regards,
Andrei
--=20
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.
(Albert Einstein)

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End of debian-user-digest Digest V2007 Issue #3005
**************************************************

Received on Fri Dec 14 14:56:33 2007
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